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Message boards : Number crunching : 2 tasks of 10 cores running simulantiously

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Greg_BE
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Joined: 20 Sep 19
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ID: 1193005
Credit: 45,107,352
RAC: 63,621
TRP LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (14,549)321 Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (107,340)PPS Sieve Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (937,138)AP 26/27 Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (270,881)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (43,390,586)WW Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (376,000)
Message 150383 - Posted: 11 May 2021 | 19:41:41 UTC

How can Woodall(LLR)(mt) and 9.01 PPS (LLR) (mt) run at the same time? (10 cores each)
I have 16 cores. 10 are used by PG and the others are spread over 4 tasks from another project and 2 controlling my GPU (combined .36 of a core)

This is physically impossible unless both projects are sharing the same 10 cores?

Profile GrebulonerProject donor
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Credit: 2,104,643,125
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Discovered 2 mega primesFound 2 primes in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 4 primes in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 3 primes in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 4 primes in the 2021 Tour de Primes321 LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,716,067)Cullen LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,754,874)ESP LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,453,074)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,310,104)PPS LLR Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (51,079,843)PSP LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,571,669)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (29,724,019)SR5 LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (21,257,664)SGS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (21,429,807)TRP LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,191,201)Woodall LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,376,385)321 Sieve (suspended) Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (55,630,889)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,178,073)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (56,046,594)PPS Sieve Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (521,014,891)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,468,384)TRP Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,076,645)AP 26/27 Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (500,106,006)GFN Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (256,908,571)WW Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (298,176,000)PSA Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (126,200,096)
Message 150386 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 4:24:15 UTC - in response to Message 150383.

Actually, to be the bearer of bad news, if you're talking about the Ryzen 2700 on your account, you only have 8 physical cores. The other 8 threads are logical. There are many threads on this forum about this discrepancy and how to get the most out of such a system. Search for "hyperthreading".

Regardless of that, to address the matter at hand, I don't think it is actually doing both at the same time, but rather switching between the two units. This happens a lot when you have mixed long (e.g. Woodall) and short (e.g. PPS) tasks. When you get near the end of a task, Boinc downloads a new one, but when they are vastly different sizes, it starts to switch back and forth because of a) different deadline setups and b) weird logic, until the first finally finishes.

Or, I could be off base. Can you take a screenshot of your Boinc window showing both tasks?
____________
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Discovered 1 mega prime321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,038,739)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,074,615)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,243,517)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,142,353)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,292,665)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,232,103)SoB LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,934,612)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,053,250)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,152,318)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,405,015)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,014,811)321 Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (23,770,672)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (944,431)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,813,253)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (342,048,709)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,446,797)AP 26/27 Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (33,140,471)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (49,299,387)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,792,000)PSA Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,457,430)
Message 150388 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 9:35:23 UTC - in response to Message 150383.

How can Woodall(LLR)(mt) and 9.01 PPS (LLR) (mt) run at the same time? (10 cores each)
I have 16 cores. 10 are used by PG and the others are spread over 4 tasks from another project and 2 controlling my GPU (combined .36 of a core)

This is physically impossible unless both projects are sharing the same 10 cores?


I've seen that on my own pc's before and eventually one of the tasks should say 'waiting to run' as like you say there is not enough resources to run it.

Greg_BE
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Joined: 20 Sep 19
Posts: 17
ID: 1193005
Credit: 45,107,352
RAC: 63,621
TRP LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (14,549)321 Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (107,340)PPS Sieve Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (937,138)AP 26/27 Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (270,881)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (43,390,586)WW Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (376,000)
Message 150389 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 20:19:59 UTC - in response to Message 150386.

Actually, to be the bearer of bad news, if you're talking about the Ryzen 2700 on your account, you only have 8 physical cores. The other 8 threads are logical. There are many threads on this forum about this discrepancy and how to get the most out of such a system. Search for "hyperthreading".

Regardless of that, to address the matter at hand, I don't think it is actually doing both at the same time, but rather switching between the two units. This happens a lot when you have mixed long (e.g. Woodall) and short (e.g. PPS) tasks. When you get near the end of a task, Boinc downloads a new one, but when they are vastly different sizes, it starts to switch back and forth because of a) different deadline setups and b) weird logic, until the first finally finishes.

Or, I could be off base. Can you take a screenshot of your Boinc window showing both tasks?



They both completed the other day while I was at work, so can't show you anything. They finished ok.

And I am using the maximum capabilities of this system, hyperthreading and 2 gpu's.
So I can run 10 "cores" in whatever fashion BOINC needs.

Greg_BE
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Joined: 20 Sep 19
Posts: 17
ID: 1193005
Credit: 45,107,352
RAC: 63,621
TRP LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (14,549)321 Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (107,340)PPS Sieve Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (937,138)AP 26/27 Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (270,881)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (43,390,586)WW Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (376,000)
Message 150390 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 20:21:41 UTC - in response to Message 150388.

How can Woodall(LLR)(mt) and 9.01 PPS (LLR) (mt) run at the same time? (10 cores each)
I have 16 cores. 10 are used by PG and the others are spread over 4 tasks from another project and 2 controlling my GPU (combined .36 of a core)

This is physically impossible unless both projects are sharing the same 10 cores?


I've seen that on my own pc's before and eventually one of the tasks should say 'waiting to run' as like you say there is not enough resources to run it.



I just let them run, they completed ok. It was weird.
I am busy with WCG right now, so PG has to wait its turn. Maybe tomorrow sometime I can see if this impossible repeats.

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Discovered 2 mega primesFound 4 primes in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 2 mega primes in the 2021 Tour de Primes321 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,011,712)Cullen LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,025,728)ESP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,176,490)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,020,580)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (29,281,953)PSP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,055,994)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (40,958,919)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,885,368)SGS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,007,143)TRP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,009,531)Woodall LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,039,527)321 Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,019,388)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (265,102,350)PPS Sieve Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (547,992,812)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,801,812)AP 26/27 Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (93,546,934)GFN Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (439,903,440)WW Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (808,248,000)
Message 150391 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 20:27:33 UTC - in response to Message 150389.
Last modified: 12 May 2021 | 20:28:20 UTC


And I am using the maximum capabilities of this system, hyperthreading and 2 gpu's.
So I can run 10 "cores" in whatever fashion BOINC needs.

With LLR you're actually slowing things down substantially by doing that.
eg your SGS tasks you're running 2 every 10 minues. You should be able to run 8 in that time.

Werinbert
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321 LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (784,049)Cullen LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (529,186)ESP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (513,315)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (521,209)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,770,986)PSP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (566,492)SoB LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (597,244)SR5 LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (665,436)SGS LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (585,571)TRP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (562,418)Woodall LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (615,831)321 Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,014,922)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,101,470)PPS Sieve Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (100,344,557)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (715,073)TRP Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (630,833)AP 26/27 Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (33,338,578)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (38,531,667)WW Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (100,076,000)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,047,861)
Message 150392 - Posted: 12 May 2021 | 20:50:56 UTC

Boinc is letting the tasks run through a time sharing scheme. Although you may have allocated 10 threads to a task Boinc is only allowing a few threads to process your work at a time. I believe this is an artifact of how Boinc implements multi-threading.

If you look at your non-GPU tasks and multiply the run time by 10 (number of threads allocated) you will see a vast difference between runtime and cpu time. These two numbers should be about the same, however when tasks are "running" but not "processing" it will result in what you see is happening to your tasks.

------

Now that LLR2 has been implemented there is far less incentive to run many threads for any given task...


____________
Werinbert is not prime... or PRPnet keeps telling me so.
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Posts: 816
ID: 91622
Credit: 2,342,089,257
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Discovered 2 mega primesFound 4 primes in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 2 mega primes in the 2021 Tour de Primes321 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,011,712)Cullen LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,025,728)ESP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,176,490)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,020,580)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (29,281,953)PSP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,055,994)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (40,958,919)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,885,368)SGS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,007,143)TRP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,009,531)Woodall LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,039,527)321 Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,019,388)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (265,102,350)PPS Sieve Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (547,992,812)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,801,812)AP 26/27 Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (93,546,934)GFN Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (439,903,440)WW Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (808,248,000)
Message 150402 - Posted: 13 May 2021 | 7:40:50 UTC - in response to Message 150392.
Last modified: 13 May 2021 | 7:43:58 UTC


These two numbers should be about the same, however when tasks are "running" but not "processing" it will result in what you see is happening to your tasks.

cpu time ~= runtime * cores used.



Now that LLR2 has been implemented there is far less incentive to run many threads for any given task...


This is so wrong it's not funny. Please go and read some of the multithreading topics.

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Message boards : Number crunching : 2 tasks of 10 cores running simulantiously

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