If you're wondering what has happened to seventeenorbust.com and have found this forum, here's what I know right now:

Louie has had some difficulty with the server, domain name, and/or hosting platform and is in the process of transferring the server. It's unclear right now how long it will take, but he's working on it.

Seventeenorbust.com's own forums can be found here: http://www.free-dc.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?38-Seventeen-or-Bust-*Official*-Project-Forum
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

Update:

The latest word from Louie is not good. The server and the backups appear to be lost. It's unclear whether the SoB project will be coming back.

As of right now, we intend to keep on working on our 2 k's. Beyond that it's too early to say.
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

This is not good.
I really hope there is some way for this project to proceed onward. I'd really like to see it proven.
SoB was the distributed computing project I ran after giving up on SETI@Home.
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My Primes
Badge Score: 4*2 + 6*2 + 7*4 + 8*9 + 11*3 + 12*1 = 165

Would anyone here have a recent copy of http://seventeenorbust.com/sieve/results.txt.bz2 (not posting as a link because that site is gone). Louie Helm from seventeenorbust.com is looking for one.

Update:

The latest word from Louie is not good. The server and the backups appear to be lost. It's unclear whether the SoB project will be coming back.

As of right now, we intend to keep on working on our 2 k's. Beyond that it's too early to say.

Would anyone here have a recent copy of http://seventeenorbust.com/sieve/results.txt.bz2 (not posting as a link because that site is gone). Louie Helm from seventeenorbust.com is looking for one.

Any time frame on how much work WE have left?

Not that it's an issue, but if we had to recreate the sieve file from scratch for some reason, it would probably take about a year to do that based upon how quickly the recent ESP sieving was done. I'm pretty sure I have more than a year's worth of SoB work already leaded into the server. So in that worse-than-worst-case scenario, we still wouldn't run out of work.
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

I have the sob sieve file I sent to Louie just before he went on walkabout.
I can email it to you if you want it.

Under "Subproject Status", the "Range Statistics" for SoB look different. has primegrid taken over for seventeenorbust.com?

Unfortunately JeppeSN is right.

Thinking of it as "we're overdue to find a prime" is like flipping a coin 10 times and it coming up heads 10 times and then expecting the next flip to have better than 50/50 odds of being tails. It doesn't work that way. Primes found or not found in the past have no effect on the odds of finding primes in subsequent searches.

Furthermore, since both the difficulty goes up significantly and the chances of finding primes go down significantly as the size of the candidate goes up, as the search continues the correct expectation is that it will now take even longer until we find the next prime. In fact, the expected time to find the next prime goes up rather dramatically as the candidates increase in size. Chris Caldwell, on his Top 5000 primes site, uses a "prime score" formula that approximates how hard it is to find a prime. It takes into account not only the rarity of the prime, but also the difficulty of testing the prime. The "prime score" formula here at PrimeGrid is similar. The difficult of finding a prime with X digits, and therefore the expected amount of time until we find a prime, is proportional to X^3 * ln(X).

As an example, the SoB project is currently searching numbers with about 9.3 million digits and PSP is searching numbers with about 5.6 million digits. I therefore expect it will take about 5 times longer to find the next SoB prime than the next PSP prime.

There's some other factors involved such as the number of k's and the "weight" of each k, but they won't affect the big picture by much. Also, that approximation assumes that you are putting equal computing power on both PSP and SoB. In general, people tend to prefer smaller tasks, so it's likely there's more cores crunching PSP than SoB.

Rather than being "due", the further the SoB project goes, the worse our chances of quickly finding a prime become.
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

Not that it's an issue, but if we had to recreate the sieve file from scratch for some reason, it would probably take about a year to do that based upon how quickly the recent ESP sieving was done. I'm pretty sure I have more than a year's worth of SoB work already leaded into the server. So in that worse-than-worst-case scenario, we still wouldn't run out of work.

I keep meaning to reply to this. I have all the factors from just over 1M to 1G for the current 6 candidates. I also have all the factors ever submitted in the sieve effort from 1G on up to when we stopped. And the NewPgen files for the current 6 candidates.

I did say I'd let you know as soon as I heard anything, so here it is. It's not good news, unfortunately.

There's no hope of recovering the data or software from the SoB server. It's gone. The SeventeenOrBust.com server is not coming back.

Louie has asked us to take over the entire SoB search. We intend to do so, but I can't tell you exactly what that means. For now, we are crunching all 6 Ks in the 31M < n < 32M range, and we'll continue with that until we decide how to move forward.

Everyone from SoB is, of course, welcome to come on over to PrimeGrid and continue the search here.

I'd like, at this point, to sincerely thank everyone who sent us their log files. Of all the information we've been able to gather from different sources, I suspect that your log files may end up being the most useful. They contain the most recent information, regarding the largest tasks. Those are most useful.
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

I have a lot of the old SoB project prime.log files - where should I send them?

I have a lot of the old SoB project prime.log files - where should I send them?

You can send them to me at mgoetz [at] primegrid [dot] com.

Thanks!

I will do that when I can get around to it. One thing, I'm subscribed to this thread and another one, I have my correct email address, but I am not getting notices of new messages in the forum. Shouldn't I be getting notices?

Hi Michael,

any information or progress update about the reset/take over of SoB since July?

Thanks
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Badge Score: 1*4 + 1*5 + 7*6 + 8*7 + 3*8 + 1*9 = 140

Hi Michael,

any information or progress update about the reset/take over of SoB since July?

Thanks

It looks like I posted on the SoB forums, but not here. Sorry about that. Here's a copy of that message:

I did say I'd let you know as soon as I heard anything, so here it is. It's not good news, unfortunately.

There's no hope of recovering the data or software from the SoB server. It's gone. SoB is not coming back.

Louie has asked us to take over the entire SoB search. We intend to do so, but I can't tell you exactly what that means. For now, we are crunching all 6 Ks in the 31M < n < 32M range, and we'll continue with that until we decide how to move forward.

You are all, of course, welcome to come on over to PrimeGrid and help with SoB.

I'd like, at this point, to sincerely thank everyone who sent us their log files. Of all the information we've been able to gather from different sources, I suspect that your log files may end up being the most useful. They contain the most recent information, regarding the largest tasks. Those are most useful.

No decisions have been made yet regarding what that actually means in terms how we're going to search the 6 remaining Ks, what's going to be double checked, or what we're going to do about all the missing results. I'll be honest -- it's a pretty ugly situation and fixing it may take years of crunching to replace what was lost.

I've said it before, but I don't see the point in redoing the SoB stuff that was lost. We know approximately the limit on the exponents that were checked - it makes the most sense to restart there.

No decisions have been made yet regarding what that actually means in terms how we're going to search the 6 remaining Ks, what's going to be double checked, or what we're going to do about all the missing results. I'll be honest -- it's a pretty ugly situation and fixing it may take years of crunching to replace what was lost.

I've said it before, but I don't see the point in redoing the SoB stuff that was lost. We know approximately the limit on the exponents that were checked - it makes the most sense to restart there.

Reading the outcome of this has made me sad that so many of the results were lost. That said, I would definitely put some of my CPU cycles to use working on the double check effort.
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How many numbers has PrimeGrid checked for primality, which tested as composite the first time but a double-check showed it to be prime?

Each test produces a residue which can be compared against a 2nd computer. If the values match, you can be fairly certain it is a good result. There are cases where both could produce the same incorrect result, but this is unlikely.

The fear is, if a faulty system says a number is composite when it is really prime, you could be doing a lot more work with a lot more computers for a long time. There is a tradeoff between being sure there isn't a smaller prime, against doing separate first and double check passes.

If anyone remembers the rieselsieve project before it suddenly disappeared, in that I actually found a decent size prime for the time in double check. That was at n around 1.5M, whereas first pass testing was around 2M two years before that (when I got another one). For that k, a lot of tests would not need to have been done had the prime been detected earlier.

Look at the bright side of life :

Worst scenario: We need to 'restart' from scratch all remaining 6 k until we reach the current already double checked lower bound on PrimeGrid.

1: That means small WUs at start. We could catch some people that run away SoB project due to very very long tasks on old computers.

2: This will give a chance for these people to get some SoB badges.

3: What about a separate project like ESP and PSP (I know,not really the same case) that will run only the single/double check SoB task to the current PrimeGrid bounds? Double Seventeen or Bust: DSB
This will let crunchers the choice to continue SoB or start the new one for multiple reasons
- Keep most powerful computers on SoB and add old ones to the new project
- Really think a prime has been missed in the range to double check.
- Add yours....
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Badge Score: 1*4 + 1*5 + 7*6 + 8*7 + 3*8 + 1*9 = 140

3: What about a separate project like ESP and PSP (I know,not really the same case) that will run only the single/double check SoB task to the current PrimeGrid bounds? Double

3: What about a separate project like ESP and PSP (I know,not really the same case) that will run only the single/double check SoB task to the current PrimeGrid bounds? Double

I like the idea of doubling down on SoB. It could be a separate project that contributes to the same badge, similar to how PPS/PPS Mega/PPSE are broken out.

What about a limited number of checks (10-20) on each computer, to detect the faulty ones?

3: What about a separate project like ESP and PSP (I know,not really the same case) that will run only the single/double check SoB task to the current PrimeGrid bounds? Double

I like the idea of doubling down on SoB. It could be a separate project that contributes to the same badge, similar to how PPS/PPS Mega/PPSE are broken out.

Before I comment on this, I want to reiterate that no decisions have been made. This is the kind of question that's been discussed internally.

One reason NOT to do what you suggest is that if a double check does indeed discover a missed prime, all the ongoing work on the main leading edge SOB tasks in that K would be for wasted. That's a strong incentive to suspend leading edge work on SoB while the double check is running. In the long view, "X" amount of computer power is needed to prove this conjecture, and it doesn't matter in which order you do the work. However, doing unnecessary work (e.g., searching candidates at a high n when there's a prime at a lower n) increases the total amount of work that must be done.

3: What about a separate project like ESP and PSP (I know,not really the same case) that will run only the single/double check SoB task to the current PrimeGrid bounds? Double

I like the idea of doubling down on SoB. It could be a separate project that contributes to the same badge, similar to how PPS/PPS Mega/PPSE are broken out.

Before I comment on this, I want to reiterate that no decisions have been made. This is the kind of question that's been discussed internally.

One reason NOT to do what you suggest is that if a double check does indeed discover a missed prime, all the ongoing work on the main leading edge SOB tasks in that K would be for wasted. That's a strong incentive to suspend leading edge work on SoB while the double check is running. In the long view, "X" amount of computer power is needed to prove this conjecture, and it doesn't matter in which order you do the work. However, doing unnecessary work (e.g., searching candidates at a high n when there's a prime at a lower n) increases the total amount of work that must be done.

Ahh yes, that is a very valid point.

It is interesting, are you completely trust to those log files which had been sent you.
Because those logs can be corrupted or modified intentionally (or not).

I don't have the same factor file as anyone on my 8 valid SOB's. Is this pretty common? Is there any difference between AVX FFT and FM3 FFT? Could AES, AVX, FM3's produce different factors by design? I don't have ECC ram and remember someone saying something about the likely hood of my computer having a memory error was a 50% chance in a 60 day period of time.

Am I the bad computer? How often do computers find the same factor?

Oh, I thought that people with a crown by their name automatically had access to that data.

https://www.primegrid.com/workunit.php?wuid=500058334 The ( ) is always different, should they be finding the same factor file?

LLR Program - Version 3.8.17, using Gwnum Library Version 28.8
Using all-complex FMA3 FFT length 2880K, Pass1=384, Pass2=7680, a = 3
15:30:29 (2956): called boinc_finish

I don't have the same factor file as anyone on my 8 valid SOB's.

The SoB community has certainly had its share of bad news this year, so it's time for some good news.

There's 5 Ks remaining in the Sierpinski Problem.
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My lucky number is 75898⁵²⁴²⁸⁸+1

The SoB community has certainly had its share of bad news this year, so it's time for some good news.

There's 5 Ks remaining in the Sierpinski Problem.

The SoB community has certainly had its share of bad news this year, so it's time for some good news.

There's 5 Ks remaining in the Sierpinski Problem.

No way.... could this mean that there's a new optimal sieve depth that would re-open the SoB SV??

We should see a prime soon.
"On the number of primes in a sequence" by Yves Gallot

Roger quoted this in a few of his threads. I would post my graph but can not figure out a way to do it